tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post157643562448596792..comments2023-11-09T05:50:27.936-08:00Comments on The Facts About Islam: Christian Voice ‘Mosque Watch’Yahya Snowhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/18373097645466995642noreply@blogger.comBlogger82125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-36341571579688805572012-01-01T17:12:54.892-08:002012-01-01T17:12:54.892-08:00radical moderate ,
from you :
'..Yes it is al...radical moderate ,<br /><br />from you :<br />'..Yes it is allahs mercy that he places a Jew or Christian in hell INSTEAD of a MUSLIM.<br /><br />Sam1528 seriously how can anyone expect for you to deal with honeslty with the text of Chritians and Jews when you can not even deal honestly with what your own texts teach..'<br /><br />Why not Allah place trinitrians (aka shamonians) like you in hell?? Even the god man that you worship admitted that god is one but you in your stubborn ignorance insist 3 in 1. I believe people like you deserve such punishment by Allah unless you repent.<br /><br />What text are you still ranting about?? I quoted from the highest authority that is the Quran. Therefore the hadiths you quoted (and abused) need to be reconciled with the Quran , not the other way around.<br /><br />By the way , you are twisting your words again. No where in the said hadiths you quoted stated or in context : '..it is allahs mercy that he places a Jew or Christian in hell INSTEAD of a MUSLIM..'.<br /><br />This again is evidence of your inconsistency and dishonesty.sam1528https://www.blogger.com/profile/01382805827344948691noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-18409510132286014132011-12-31T23:40:42.463-08:002011-12-31T23:40:42.463-08:00بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم
RM,
See here your clerics...بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم<br /><br />RM,<br /><br />See here your clerics scuffling at the place where Jesus supposedly born.<br /><br />What a display of peace and harmony.<br /><br />http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=LhDMCRlFAxs<br /><br />If your learned men right in your holiest place do this kinna stuff no wonder your religion have been champion in large scale mass murder.<br /><br />Happy brawling new year<br /><br />Wassalamerikfadlinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-42805595530899351452011-12-31T18:48:27.780-08:002011-12-31T18:48:27.780-08:00Sam1528 you wrote....
"Then you are playing ...Sam1528 you wrote....<br /><br />"Then you are playing with words as usual. The only one who is playing with words is you sir.<br /><br /><br />You also wrote...<br /><br />"Everyone else understand context. And by everyone you obvioulsy mean everyone but you.<br /><br /><br />You wrote..<br /><br />"The quranic verse has been provided that states no one bears the sins of another and a hadith stating that the muslim will be rescued from hell by Allah mercy (ie. forgiveness)."<br /><br />Yes it is allahs mercy that he places a Jew or Christian in hell INSTEAD of a MUSLIM.<br /><br />Sam1528 seriously how can anyone expect for you to deal with honeslty with the text of Chritians and Jews when you can not even deal honestly with what your own texts teach.Radical Moderatehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01563355121096154790noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-69006382076570151092011-12-31T18:31:14.622-08:002011-12-31T18:31:14.622-08:00radical moderate ,
Then you are playing with word...radical moderate ,<br /><br />Then you are playing with words as usual. Everyone else understand context. The quranic verse has been provided that states no one bears the sins of another and a hadith stating that the muslim will be rescued from hell by Allah mercy (ie. forgiveness). Reconciling the Quran / Hadith with the hadiths you mentioned <br />(1) the said muslim gets rescued from hell by Allah mercy (ie. forgiveness)<br />(2) the vacancy left by the said muslim gets filled up with christians (like you)<br /><br />Where is the so called substitutionary atonement that you so argued like crazy??<br /><br />Which part of it that you don't understand? This shows that you are a shallow person who is embarrassed by the christian theology of substitutionary atonement. Yet you are inviting us muslims to christianity of which christians like you have changed to a religion with pagan undertone.sam1528https://www.blogger.com/profile/01382805827344948691noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-15166813996063966862011-12-31T18:16:24.856-08:002011-12-31T18:16:24.856-08:00fifth monarchy man ,
You are going around in circ...fifth monarchy man ,<br /><br />You are going around in circles. Since you claim that the bible is the word of your god therefore<br />(1) Nowhere in the bible at any one time biblical jesus ever claimed to be god<br />(2) His disciples claimed of him to be a man not god or man god<br /><br />Therefore biblical jesus was / is a man not god or man god. How come christians like you regard biblical jesus to be god or man god??<br /><br />The problem you have with joh15 is that christians have this shallow claim about not killing apostates and they are extremely embarrassed with biblical verses that in any way implies killing of apostates. <br /><br />--------------------<br /><br />You asked for the definition of repentance , it has been provided. Why are you still asking what is true repentance?? The issue is that if the person had repented , he should have not killed the 'first' wise man. In context , he could have repented somewhere between killing the first wise man and meeting with the second wise man. This is logical .... isn't it?? Can you do the following :<br />(1) go back to the site I provided and list the points of repentance<br />(2) list your christian understanding of repentance<br /><br />Compare them. Can you do that??<br /><br />Why do you need biblical jesus to die for your sins if you have the avenue to repent? It is already a contradiction.sam1528https://www.blogger.com/profile/01382805827344948691noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-59784208698757054572011-12-31T11:29:39.543-08:002011-12-31T11:29:39.543-08:00بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم
RM,
Thanks for the Deut ...بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم<br /><br /><br />RM,<br /><br />Thanks for the Deut 14:7.<br /><br />I must apologize I never know that there is specific Camel prohibition in book of Deuteronomy. <br /><br />My short answer is I don't follow it because the Qur'an or authentic ahadith never says so (although I never eat Camel meat in my life :D))<br /><br />Interesting thing is I just learn that in a hadith it is said that eating Camel meat nullify the wudu, there must be something unclean about it.<br /><br />Wallahu 'alim<br /><br />WassalamAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-25418866188025858682011-12-31T11:19:28.546-08:002011-12-31T11:19:28.546-08:00@Sam1528
You asked
"Why can't the RESC...@Sam1528<br /><br />You asked <br /><br />"Why can't the RESCUE be forgiveness from Allah??<br /><br />and<br /><br />Why can't the admission of IN HIS STEAD be the kaffirs filling up the vacancy left by the RESCUED muslim??"<br /><br />The simple answer WORDS HAVE MEANING.<br /><br />Hey while your making stuff up then why not just say that the when your allah says<br /><br />Do not eat pork or drink alchhol it really means that you are to drink alchol and eat pork.<br /><br />Now as far as your first question.<br /><br />It is RESCUE from allah the rescue is a JEW or Christain being placed in hell INTSTEAD of a Muslim.<br /><br />TO answer your second question...<br /><br />Filling up the vacancy's lol<br /><br />Oh man so then Christians only go to hell when there is room.<br /><br />Come on man its just pathetic this resposne of yours.<br /><br />I invite you again to pick up your CROSS, BEND YOUR KNEE and Save yourself from the corrupt and wicked generation.Radical Moderatehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01563355121096154790noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-6415447702866805122011-12-31T10:58:28.460-08:002011-12-31T10:58:28.460-08:00بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم
FMM on against God's...بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم<br /><br /><br /><br />FMM on against God's prohibition of eating pork:<br /><br />"..<br />Acts 10:12-15<br />Mark 7:18-19<br />.."<br /><br />Can you please be more honest?<br /><br />Context please.<br /><br />The vision does not say that at all. <br /><br />Here is Peter’s understanding of what the vision was all about:<br /><br />He said to them: “You are well aware that it is against our law for a Jew to associate with or visit a Gentile. But God has shown me that **I should not call anyone impure or unclean**. (NIV Acts 10:28)<br /><br /><br />My take on Mark 7:18-19 is to do with false disciple Paul evangelization among the Pagans. <br /><br />Paul knew that there were first Christians who were objecting to those who "eat anything" (Romans 14).<br /><br />The pro pauline scribes then introduces their own political agenda to createa a divison to those who are stilll keeping the dietary laws and those who are not by their editorial addition in Mark 7:19, "Thus he declared all foods clean" <br /><br />Allow all that is forbidden, to be acceptable. <br /><br />Great way to get those Pagans to become Christian.<br /><br />WassalamAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-87815374853587579722011-12-31T07:51:23.944-08:002011-12-31T07:51:23.944-08:00sam said,
The question now : has the man repented...sam said,<br /><br />The question now : has the man repented? If he had , he wouldn't have killed the first wise man ... would he??<br /><br />I say,<br /><br />Again please explain what repentance is. <br /><br />The haddith says he repented now you say he did not. I'm confused<br /><br />Is repentance just not doing it again? Then most murderers have repented since they only do it once. <br /><br />please explain. What does "true" repentance entail in Islam? <br /><br />Is it the same as Christian repentance? Is it changing selfish rebelion for selfless submition to God?<br /><br />Is it like being born again??? <br /><br />peaceFifth Monarchy Manhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11490334525087698221noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-90746174310251695132011-12-31T07:15:39.694-08:002011-12-31T07:15:39.694-08:00hey eric,
you said,
You really have a lot of tim...hey eric,<br /><br />you said,<br /><br />You really have a lot of time in the internet.<br /><br />I say,<br /><br />I'm on vacation this week.<br /><br />you say,<br /><br />Im starting to suspects this "FMM" account are just a group of evangelicals.<br /><br />I say,<br /><br />Just me and the Holy Spirit. <br /><br /><br />You say,<br /><br />Im asking you again, do you have a name? <br /><br />I say,<br /><br />I do but I would just assume not share it in a forum like this to protect my family. <br /><br />Ive been threatened in the past and it's better to be safe than sorry when it comes to my loved ones. <br /><br />If you lived near me I would be happy to have you over for lemonade but as it is I don't expect us to be chums. <br /><br />You say,<br /><br />You dont seem to enjoy this holiday season.<br /><br />I say,<br /><br />I'm a Puritan when it comes to all holidays I think for most folks they are just and excuse to party. but that's just me <br /><br />You say,<br /><br />Btw, have you stopped eating pork yet?? <br /><br />We must obey God's order<br /><br />I say,<br /><br />I agree and when it comes to food in the New covenant God explicitly says <br /><br /><br />In it were all kinds of animals and reptiles and birds of the air. And there came a voice to him: "Rise, Peter; kill and eat." But Peter said, "By no means, Lord; for I have never eaten anything that is common or unclean." And the voice came to him again a second time, "What God has made clean, do not call common." <br />(Acts 10:12-15)<br /><br /><br />and <br /><br />And he said to them, "Then are you also without understanding? Do you not see that whatever goes into a person from outside cannot defile him, since it enters not his heart but his stomach, and is expelled?" (Thus he declared all foods clean.) <br />(Mark 7:18-19)<br /><br />Who am I to prohibit what God does not prohibit?<br /><br />peaceFifth Monarchy Manhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11490334525087698221noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-77795658253494090602011-12-31T07:01:40.191-08:002011-12-31T07:01:40.191-08:00sam said,
If no christian ever claim that biblic...sam said,<br /><br /> If no christian ever claim that biblical jesus was a man , why did peter in acts2 claim as such?? <br /><br />I say,<br /><br />no I know your problem you cant read. What I said was <br /><br /> No Christian ever denied that Jesus is a man.<br /><br />LOL<br /><br /><br />No wonder you are having trouble with John 15. <br /><br />peaceFifth Monarchy Manhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11490334525087698221noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-11601541681862508962011-12-31T06:45:56.417-08:002011-12-31T06:45:56.417-08:00@Erik you wrote...
"RM,
Do not eat pork!
T...@Erik you wrote...<br /><br />"RM,<br /><br />Do not eat pork!<br /><br />Thats God's order."<br /><br />I say<br /><br />Do not eat Camel or Shell Fish!<br />Its God's order.<br /><br /><br />"“Yet of those that chew the cud or have the hoof cloven you shall not eat these: the camel, the hare, and the rock badger, because they chew the cud but do not part the hoof, are unclean for you." Deut 14:7<br /><br />"And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you: 11 They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination." Leviticus 11:10-11Radical Moderatehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01563355121096154790noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-67873495539278333992011-12-30T22:12:14.743-08:002011-12-30T22:12:14.743-08:00بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم
RM,
Do not eat pork!
Tha...بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم<br /><br />RM,<br /><br />Do not eat pork!<br /><br />Thats God's order.<br /><br />Shellfish, there is no specific references in the Quran<br /><br />There are scholars who classify crabs and prawns as fish regard it as permissible to eat. <br /><br />However, there are many Ulama who do not classify them as fish, hence it is better to abstain. <br />I personally are abstain from it.<br /><br />No eating camel?<br /><br />Is this the Gospel of George W. Bush are you preaching again?? pathetic.<br /><br />WassalamAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-37559095187296987992011-12-30T20:23:30.194-08:002011-12-30T20:23:30.194-08:00radical moderate ,
The question now : has the man...radical moderate ,<br /><br />The question now : has the man repented? If he had , he wouldn't have killed the first wise man ... would he??<br /><br />There are 2 things here<br />(1) has the man repented to Allah??<br />(2) repentance to Allah is one thing , however he needs to atone for his wrongdoing to the community and seek their forgiveness as pointed out by the second wise man.<br /><br />Reversing the challenge :<br />How will be his repentance be in christianity? He accepts christ and suddenly everything is good for him? Accepting christ and repenting are 2 different things. What about his crimes to the community??<br /><br />How is the concept that biblical jesus suicide atone for his sins? Biblical jesus did not do of such. How is the mechanism of the so called sin transfer or sin erasure?<br /><br />What happens if he is already a christian?? Biblical jesus need to commit suicide for the 2nd time??sam1528https://www.blogger.com/profile/01382805827344948691noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-79722604100278241622011-12-30T20:13:50.530-08:002011-12-30T20:13:50.530-08:00fifth monarchy man ,
Do you know the definition o...fifth monarchy man ,<br /><br />Do you know the definition of a parable??<br /><br />Why are jumping from a parable to literal? Simple , it is because you are dishonest in your argument.<br /><br />joh15:1-3 is just the will of god , who being saved and condemned. joh15:5-6 clearly states that 'you' are the branches. By not remaining in him (biblical jesus) the said branch is picked up , thrown and burned. Isn't that an instruction to burn the said branch or in other words , burn the apostates??<br /><br />Come on , the very least exhibit some intellectual honesty.<br /><br />--------------------<br /><br />If no christian ever claim that biblical jesus was a man , why did peter in acts2 claim as such?? acts2:22 '..Jesus of Nazareth was a man accredited by God to you by miracles, wonders and signs, which God did among you through him..'<br />The context of it : peter claimed that biblical jesus was a man , he performed miracles , an act of god thru him (biblical jesus). Is peter christian?? Was he speaking for himself or it was god speaking thru him?? Even the disciples of biblical jesus admitted that he was / is just a man.sam1528https://www.blogger.com/profile/01382805827344948691noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-49430605033169391872011-12-30T20:00:05.024-08:002011-12-30T20:00:05.024-08:00fifth monarchy man ,
If one repent for selfish re...fifth monarchy man ,<br /><br />If one repent for selfish reason , it wouldn't be repentance from the heart ... would it?? This is crazy.<br /><br />What discussion are you looking for with regards to repentance? Ha ha , accepting biblical jesus death means born again and genuine repentance?? No sane mind can accept this. Repentance is a promise that one will never repeat one's sin and one is sorry. You asked for such definition , it has been provided.<br /><br />The big question : why should the death or another erase the sin of another?? This is a pagan concept. Repentance is between god and the person ... nothing to do with the supposed suicide of a so called man god to erase one's sin.sam1528https://www.blogger.com/profile/01382805827344948691noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-35993732250123999912011-12-30T19:51:58.153-08:002011-12-30T19:51:58.153-08:00fifth monarchy man ,
Since you want to be technic...fifth monarchy man ,<br /><br />Since you want to be technical about it , Hossein Soodmand was executed due to apostasy and proselytising. We all know the underhand tactics of christian proselytising is well documented from phoney aid for the poor / hungry in exchange for conversion to christianity to kidnapping orphans from disaster struck areas.<br /><br />What about the martyrs of cordoba , they were christian monks not muslims. You can call them martyrs but they disparaged Islam. At that time , if you disparage christianity , the church will take the same action.<br /><br />Ha ha , servetus was executed on the grounds of blasphemy?? Do you now at that time changing from one denomination to another is already considered apostasy??<br /><br />I repeat my question : who was a peaceful apostate that has been executed by an Islamic state?? Soodmand was executed due to apostasy and proselytising.<br /><br />Ha ha , now you give hadiths about the so called death sentence for apostasy?? Such is easily refuted by this article from loon watch (a non muslim site)<br /><a href="http://www.loonwatch.com/2009/09/apostasy/" rel="nofollow">apostasy in islam and christianity</a><br />The background of hadiths you mentioned - its during war.<br /><br />Interestingly : Bukhari <br />Volume 9, Book 92, Number 424t:<br />Narrated Jabir bin 'Abdullah As-Salami:<br />A bedouin gave the Pledge of allegiance for embracing Islam to Allah's Apostle, and then he got an attack of fever in Medina and came to Allah's Apostle: and said, "O Allah's Apostle! Cancel my pledge." Allah's Apostle refused to do so. The bedouin came to him again and said, "Cancel my pledge," but he refused again, and then again, the bedouin came to him and said, "Cancel my pledge," and Allah's Apostle refused. The bedouin finally went away, and Allah's Apostle said, "Medina is like a pair of bellows (furnace), it expels its impurities while it brightens and clears its good.' <br /><br />Any execution??<br /><br />Its about time you admit that its only in christianity / bible that have an injunction to kill peaceful apostates.sam1528https://www.blogger.com/profile/01382805827344948691noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-90458631181040921362011-12-30T18:58:33.151-08:002011-12-30T18:58:33.151-08:00radical moderate ,
Ha ha , poor you again. You ar...radical moderate ,<br /><br />Ha ha , poor you again. You are basically arguing blind. <br /><br />From you :<br />'.." Allah would deliver to every Muslim a Jew or a Christian and say: That is your RESCUE from Hell-Fire."..'<br /><br />Why can't the RESCUE be forgiveness from Allah??<br /><br />From you :<br />'.."No Muslim would die but Allah would admit IN HIS STEAD a Jew or a Christian in Hell-Fire. "..'<br /><br />Why can't the admission of IN HIS STEAD be the kaffirs filling up the vacancy left by the RESCUED muslim??<br /><br />Reconciling the 2 : Its forgiveness of Allah that rescue the muslim from hell and the vacancy left behind will be filled up with people like you. The big question : where is the so called substitutionary atonement that you have argued sooo far?? Again barking up the wrong tree .... the story of your life.<br /><br />I have already copy pasted the response refuting your really pathetic argument. It comes from the Quranic verse that no one is responsible for the sins of others. Here is another from bro bassam zawadi :<br />'..Volume 9, Book 93, Number 542:<br />Narrated Anas:<br />The Prophet said, "Some people who will be scorched by Hell (Fire) as a punishment for sins they have committed, and then Allah will admit them into Paradise by the grant of His Mercy. These people will be called, 'Al-JahannamiyyLin' (the people of Hell)."..'<br /><br /><a href="http://www.call-to-monotheism.com/rebuttal_to_william_lane_craig_s_divine_insurance_policy_analogy" rel="nofollow">hell to heaven by Allah mercy</a> <br /><br />Oops .... got you again ...<br /><br />In fact you are intellectually dishonest to claim coming up with the argument yourself as its just an argument taken from your high priest of shamonian.<br /><br />Conceptually there will be an equal number of kaffirs filling up the vacancy in hell left by the RESCUED muslims. Isn't it a 1 to 1 filling in?? Such a simple concept and you screwed up sooo badly.<br /><br />From you :<br />'..So the words "DELIVER, RESQUE, ADMIT IN HIS STEAD, PLACE IN THEIR STEAD, and UNLOAD THE SINS, and PUT THE SAME OVER TEH JEWS AND CHRISTIANS"..'<br /><br />DELIVER / RESCUE / UNLOAD THE SINS : forgiveness from Allah<br /><br />ADMIT IN HIS STEAD / PLACE IN THEIR STEAD / PUT THE SAME OVER TEH JEWS AND CHRISTIANS : the jews and christians filling up the vacancy left by the RESCUED / DELIVERED / UNLOAD THE SINS muslims<br /><br />What is soooo difficult to understand?? The Quranic verse of 35:18 have refuted you.<br /><br />Arguing blind with pathetic rhetoric of pepsi / coke / swimming pool / drowning won't get you anywhere but it is evidence of the hollow / shallow theology of christianity.<br /><br />You want to invite me to 'the true living god'?? Biblical jesus never in any one time admitted that he was / is god. Are you dreaming?? Why should I being a muslim embrace paganism (aka christianity)sam1528https://www.blogger.com/profile/01382805827344948691noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-46752488065666116012011-12-30T16:48:52.168-08:002011-12-30T16:48:52.168-08:00@Erik you wrote...
"Btw, have you stopped ea...@Erik you wrote...<br /><br />"Btw, have you stopped eating pork yet?? <br /><br />We must obey God's order"<br /><br />Have you stopped eating shell fish, have you stopped eating camel.<br /><br />Why don't you obey Gods orders?Radical Moderatehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01563355121096154790noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-74961937784781612152011-12-30T16:44:48.112-08:002011-12-30T16:44:48.112-08:00بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم
Hi FMM,
You really have a...بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم<br /><br />Hi FMM,<br /><br />You really have a lot of time in the internet.<br /><br />Im starting to suspects this "FMM" account are just a group of evangelicals nutters in self delusion mission to convert muslims and destroy Islam.<br /><br />Im asking you again, do you have a name? <br /><br />You dont seem to enjoy this holiday season.<br /><br />Btw, have you stopped eating pork yet?? <br /><br />We must obey God's order<br /><br />WassalamAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-42447202154699288492011-12-30T09:46:32.947-08:002011-12-30T09:46:32.947-08:00I almost forgot
sam says,
If you claim that the...I almost forgot <br /><br />sam says,<br /><br />If you claim that the author of 1cor5:11-13 is god therefore biblical jesus was just a man as he never claim himself to be god and peter in acts2 claimed that biblical jesus was man accredited by god. <br /><br />I say,<br /><br />No Christian ever denied that Jesus is a man. Where did you ever get the idea that we did? If Jesus was not a man he could not provide atonemnt for us and we whold have no hope.<br /><br />The problem arises when you say contary to the revelation of God in the Bible that he was "just a man". <br /><br />That is not what the Bible says that is what those who deney the schripture say.<br /><br />peaceFifth Monarchy Manhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11490334525087698221noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-35400398817691376912011-12-30T08:11:14.804-08:002011-12-30T08:11:14.804-08:00@Sam1528
I just noticed this. You wrote...
"...@Sam1528<br /><br />I just noticed this. You wrote...<br /><br />"from you :<br />'..So what if a Muslim repeats his sins so then that is not true repentence?..'<br /><br />Then it wouldn't be repentance ... would it??"<br /><br />This is interesting because of the famous story I have heard repeated time and time again.<br /><br />The story goes that a man who had murdered 99 people felt sorry for all those he had murdered. So he went to see some kind of relegious leader a scholar or priest etc...<br /><br />The murder asked the priest or scholar if there was anything he could do to repent of the 99 murders. The scholar or priest replied "No there is nothing you cvan do"<br /><br />So this repentent murder responded by killing the preist or scholar. <br /><br />So he went to another town and found another preist or scholar and asked him if their was anything he could do to repent of the now 100 murders he had commited. This preist or scholar was obviously more wiser then the first one becasue he responded with ... "Go to such and such a town and ask them and they will tell you what you need to do to repent" <br /><br />So the man road out and before he could get to that town he died.<br /><br />So the question is by your standard was this man truely repentent of the 99 murders that he had comitted since he killed the 100th man after he was told that there was nothing he could do to repent of the previous 99 murders?Radical Moderatehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01563355121096154790noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-45526460020271297302011-12-30T07:40:58.136-08:002011-12-30T07:40:58.136-08:00Sam says,
You on one hand admit that its a parabl...Sam says,<br /><br />You on one hand admit that its a parable but then turn around and say '..Branches don’t kill other branches..'. First its a parable then it become literal .... inconsistency again.<br /><br />I say,<br /><br />It’s not about parable verses literal it’s about parable verses nonsensical. <br /><br />Parables are simple stories that relate profound truths they are not lumps of clay that can be molded to mean what ever you want them to mean. <br /><br />Lets do a little simple exegesis shall we <br /><br />"I am the true vine, and my Father is the vinedresser. <br />(John 15:1)<br /><br />In this parable Jesus is the vine and the Father is the one who prunes the vine and cleans up afterward (the vinedresser)<br /><br />Vines provide nourishment to branches and branches bear fruit because of the nourishment of the vine and pruning by the vinedresser. <br /><br />Vines don’t prune themselves and branches don’t clean up afterward. Any rational person can see this if you are so blind as to somehow misunderstand<br /><br />There is this <br /><br />I am the vine; you are the branches. Whoever abides in me and I in him, he it is that bears much fruit, for apart from me you can do nothing. <br />(John 15:5)<br /><br />There you Jesus plainly says<br /><br />"You can do nothing" <br /><br />As would be expected branches bear fruit. Since they are branches they can do nothing but that. <br /><br />They don’t clean up the garden they don’t prune other branches <br />They are completely passive in this story they only bear fruit. <br /><br />The work is done by the vine who provides the nutrients and the vinedresser who prunes and cleans up the garden. <br /><br />A four year old could easily understand this <br /> <br />I am done explaining such a simple story if you can’t see the obvious I give up. <br /><br />peaceFifth Monarchy Manhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11490334525087698221noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-57180742430261191832011-12-30T07:08:05.659-08:002011-12-30T07:08:05.659-08:00sam said,
Repentance is to repent from the heart,...sam said,<br /><br />Repentance is to repent from the heart, <br /><br />I say,<br /><br />what does this mean??????<br /><br />If I repent for selfish reasons does it count????<br /><br />For repentance to be genuine Christians believe ones entire perspective must change from selfish rebellion to selfless submission. Do you agree??? <br /><br />The Bible calls this sort of radical transformation like being "born again". <br /><br />For us it's not just "a firm resolution never to commit the sin again..'" <br /><br /><br />That is why I brought up the examples I did <br /><br />Come on Sam please engage me in a real discussion instead of just cutting and pasting definitions and constructing straw men.<br /><br />peaceFifth Monarchy Manhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11490334525087698221noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-248234931266550822.post-68811735030629112112011-12-30T06:56:05.411-08:002011-12-30T06:56:05.411-08:00Sam says,
Can you now give me a name of a peacefu...Sam says,<br /><br />Can you now give me a name of a peaceful apostate from Islam who has been executed by the state for apostasy in 1400 yrs of Islam?? <br /><br />I say<br /><br />In about 5 min I came up with <br /><br />Hossein Soodmand who was charged with apostasy and sentenced to death by hanging Iran - December 3, 1990 <br /><br />And Leocritia George, Aurelius Natalia, Felix and Liliosa and the other Martyrs of Cordoba <br /><br />Servetus was not executed for apostasy but for blasphemy. I know of no one who was ever executed for apostasy from Christianity. The reason you know about him is because his death was so controversial at the time. <br /><br />On the other hand right now death for apostasy is the law of the land in Iran and Afghanistan, and Saudi Arabia and I see no demonstrations in the streets protesting this even in 2011. <br /><br />One can only assume that there was even less controversy in the past . <br /><br />I have no way of knowing or verifying how many martyrdoms are carried out by the state and how many are done by individuals with state permission or sanction. For the martyr it makes no difference who actually does the killing. <br /><br />The real question is does Islam condone this kind of punishment and it seems to me the answer is clear <br /><br />Quote: <br /><br />"Allah's Apostle said, "The blood of a Muslim who confesses that none has the right to be worshipped but Allah and that I am His Apostle, cannot be shed except in three cases: In Qisas for murder, a married person who commits illegal sexual intercourse and the one who reverts from Islam (apostate) and leaves the Muslims."Sahih al-Bukhari, 9:83:17 <br /><br />and<br /><br />"Whoever changed his (Islamic) religion, then kill him" Sahih al-Bukhari, 9:84:57<br /><br />End quote<br /><br />I would love to be proven wrong on this one how about it Muslims. Will you take a stand for freedom againist Bukhari ?<br /><br />You say <br /><br /> What is there to condemn as the person has not been executed.<br /><br />I say,<br />The man is in prison right now under the sentence of death simply for what he believes and you don’t see anything to condemn. <br /><br />That says it all. <br /><br />PeaceFifth Monarchy Manhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11490334525087698221noreply@blogger.com