Fundamentalist Christian Islamophobes’ Blood Thirsty Scheming
The anti-muslim sentiment runs wild within American fundamentalist circles; wilder still, when you add an unhinged Arab Christian hate mob to the mix.
Let’s kill a few more Muslims
A Christian bigot calls in and sets pulses racing with “I know this sounds blood thirsty and cold”. He then proceeds to unveil his scheme of using Iraq and Iraqi Sunnis to fight against Iran. This, my friends, is what a heavy dose of Islamophobia does to people. The man has no regard for Muslim life or CHRISTIAN life – there are Christians living in Iraq.
Recently Muslims condemned the criminal actions of a minority in Iraq who were persecuting Christians. The Christian Islamophobes in America (and the Arabs on ABN) were having a field day in using their tears for these poor Iraqi Christians to fuel their anti-Muslim propaganda campaign.
I guess those tears must have been crocodile – that’s to say they were disingenuous. This American fundamentalist Christian and the two Arab Christians on the show clearly have no regard for the sanctity of life. These folk sound like they are straight out from a death cult.
Pastor Joseph Najm, become a lion!
This bloke is actually agreeing with the bigot caller despite being IRAQI himself and having family in IRAQ, I guess the American fundamentalists have colonised his mind and his goal is to please his new masters. Quite what the Iraqi director of ABN Sat, Bassim Gorial, thinks of the blod thirsty plot of bombing his relatives to smithereens is beyond me.
My advice to Pastor Joseph, change your name back to an Arab name and start having some self-respect. Americans are not superior to Iraqis/Arabs (nor vice versa). Try standing up against the blood thirsty schemes against YOUR people. What’s the matter? Worried your bank balance will be affected or the American fundies will ship you off to Guantanamo bay or some other torture outlet?
Develop some moral and testicular fortitude my friend. One day in the life of a lion is better than a thousand as a sheep. Sadly, Arab Christians are all too ready to be used and discarded by American fundamentalists.
To quote Bill Maher – that’s why they call them the flock.
Think for yourselves, people!!!
It gets worse for the Arabs on ABN
The caller [RadicalModerate/FatMan] actually MOCKS Arab accents in his spare time. I guess the joke is on the Arabs at ABN. I would advise them to have some self respect and stop pandering to (and imitating) red neck-type American fundamentalists.
?A bonus lady bigot on Islamophobic pills?
Lady, stop. Please stop humiliating yourself.
In the video we have another bigot caller added to the mix. This lady rang up to bash Muslim "babysitters" in Canada – she suspects they are spies and are secretly teaching Canadian kids the Quran. Paranoid, just a little?
I think she was speaking about au pairs rather than babysitters. Nevertheless, her paranoid bigotry was self evident and enough to discard her as foolish. Lady, please reform yourself.
A question on the Holy Spirit and Islamophobic hearts
You know, I don’t get it. Christian fundamentalists always claim to be guided by the holy spirit yet this type of lust for blood and disrespect for human life permeates their very being.
The solution is Islam
These Christians need a relationship with God. Jesus had a relationship with God. EVEN the unreliable Gospels make mention of him worshipping God. My advice to Christians is to be spiritual by worshipping God , just like Moses, Jesus and Muhammad did – peace be upon them. Islam is the way, the truth and the life:
http://www.ediscoverislam.com/
Special section for Assyrian and Arab Christians to convert to Islam
Feedback: yahyasnow@hotmail.com
Is the first caller our resident bigot 'thefatman'?
ReplyDeleteIf yes , ha ha , you exposed yourself buddy. In the end you are just a blood thirsty islamophobe war monger. Are you a 'chairborne warrior'? Do you get high playing 'call of duty' and then fantasize you are at war with muslims?
Too bad .... so sad
They would die convincing us how peaceful Christianity is!!! Double speech!
ReplyDeleteBeware of the Fat Man, he comes in a sheep cloth , but he is a war monger wolf.
Doesn't surprise me, pastor Joseph once justified the burning of infidel's Holy books, based on the OT. The OT is an old covenant... but sometimes it's just as new as the NT.
*sigh*
ReplyDeleteWhere are all the moderate Christians I ask?
@Sam
ReplyDeleteYep, it is he. He is older than I expected
More blood thirsty than this?:
ReplyDeleteGulfam's mother took the half-naked girl home. Then the parents went to the police to report the rape, who then arrested the suspect. But the family is terrified because the village is mainly Muslim.
The assailant reportedly told his victim “not to worry because he had done the same service to other young Christian girls.”
Christian girls are considered goods to be damaged at leisure.
Christian girls abused by wealthy Muslims.
Most cases go unpunished.
Source:
http://www.energypublisher.com/article.asp?id=45297
More consistency with the Quran! Al Queida would be proud of these Mujihadeen!
ALL CASES WILL BE PUNISHED - IN HELL
Anonymous: More blood thirsty than this?
ReplyDeleteOr this? Prominent Pastor charged with 112 counts of Child Pornography
http://answeringchristians.blogspot.com/2010/12/prominent-pastor-charged-with-112.html
Anonymous:More consistency with the Quran!
Correction. More consistency with the bible which says, "....Now kill all the boys and all the women who have slept with a man. Only the young girls who are virgins may live; you may keep them for yourselves." (Numbers 31:7-18)
To Ibn:
ReplyDeleteI had explained Num 31 before and as I said rape and sex before marriage is contrary to Mosaic law.So your argument is wrong.You certainly read that comment I had written before.The objective in life is to learn.
Regarding Irak,from the point of view of reality the Muslim people there are not,because of a certain mentality,to be able to accept human rights 100% to the point of accepting people to freely leave and criticize Islam.
So that hinders the full development of a free society.That is what ORIANA FALLACI,the atheist intellectual who was against Islam, said before she died.She was AGAINST the invasion of Irak because she knew it was impossible,unless there is a mass abandonment of religion(like in Iran)to have a real open,multicultural society.
In the case of Fatman he states the reality that Sunnis and Shiahs have been killing each other for centuries and to try to impose a real open society there is impossible,there is a closed mentality because of religious fanaticism.Not all the people,but it is in general.
To 1moremuslim:
Christianity is peaceful.Now reagrding Irak,to pull out would be to let a pro-terrorist group take over the country.As Oriana Fallaci,it was a stupid idea to invade at all.The vast majority of the innocents killed there have been by Al-Qaida,the murdering terrorists.Yet alot of people in Irak(maybe the majority)and alot of Muslims outside support them.I hope you are not one of them.
I assume you are for human rights,in Irak also,so a pullout would only open the way for an anti-human rights,religious fanatic group to take over in Irak(like it happened in IRAN).I dont think you would agree the Iran system(which is the same system that the rebels in Irak want to impose)is what you consider to be "what God wants".
minoria that is 100% not true. WHY would Muslims support Al Queda when they kill Muslims on a daily basis? No, HARDLY any sane Muslim supports extremists.
ReplyDeleteAs well minoria, how about you correct your fellow Christian anonymous instead of defending the Bible when a Muslim responds to a crazy Christian's remark?
Minoria, I read everybody's posts here except yours. You know why? Because you intentionally make your monologues huge so that nobody bothers to read them. Since nobody reads them, nobody replies to your posts and you construe that as a victory for yourself.
ReplyDeleteMinoria:
ReplyDeleteI read only the first 2 lines of your comments. Just enough to realize you are off topic as usual.
We Christians are peaceful but we go cluster bomb Iraqis, even that no Iraqi has ever killed a single American.
Hello 1moremuslim:
ReplyDeleteRead the rest of the comment to you.It explains more.
To Womanoftruth:
15% of Muslims support Al-Qaida,terrorists in general.The invasion was a bad idea,but to pull out would make the way for an ARMED GROUP(Al-Qaida)to impose an ANTI-HUMAN rights regime.Similar to IRAN,to SUDAN,SAUDI ARABIA,to the TALIBANS(when they ruled Afghanistan),etc.
PUT IN THE UN TROOPS
It could be done,but Al-Qaida would attack them also.The same thing again.I have debated Muslims,in another forum,who over and over again defended the terrorists.Such people exist,there is evil.
THE CASE OF AFGHANISTAN
After the Soviet defeat there was civil war for I think 10 years till the TALIBANS ruled for 5 years.MANY criticized the US for NOT INTERVENING.If they had we would have had another Irak.ORIANA FALLACI was right.
THE CASE OF SOMALIA
Clinton intervened for a little while because of a famine that had killed 300,000.He left soon,many said he should have done more.If he had stayed,another Irak.HOW would the Somalis have justified war against the US?In the name of Islam.
Thus begins Minoria's monologue.
ReplyDeletePlease, fewer paragraphs, shorter sentences, and smaller words. We don't want to lose the Muslims.
ReplyDelete*sigh*
ReplyDeleteSeriously, where are all the moderate Christians willing to speak out against all this Christian terrorism/extremism?
minoria may I have a modern source that say's 15% of Muslims support Al Queda? Yes It is true when the US invaded Iraq many supported the Jihad against the American Military but it fell through after Al Queda's main target's were Muslims, and Mosques.
ReplyDeleteYou also know the reason, why Al Queda and the Taliban are making terror plots in the West? No, it's not because you all are 'infidels' like how David Wood and Nabeel Quereshi and numerous other missionaries try to say. It's because of the Western Occupation.
And it obviously is America's fault for creating the extremists.
WomanforTruth101: minoria may I have a modern source that say's 15% of Muslims support Al Queda?
ReplyDeleteHis source is probably Glen Beck.
fatman just said iraq is a godless place. so to him, there's some places where god cannot be? what a moronic remark.
ReplyDeleteand aha nice job of that woman taking a crack at philippians 1:18. i live in canada, born and raised, never heard anything like this. these holy spirit guided christians come up with anything. helpless people, idiots.
Hello Womanfor truth:
ReplyDeleteYou asked for a source,there is the famous Gallup poll,cited in the Reza Aslan-Sam Harris debate.The figures are alot higher,the 15% would be a constant figure.
Here is an article that refers to the Gallup polls:
http://www.investigativeproject.org/1904/dalia-mogahed-a-muslim-george-gallup-or-islamist
Why does Al-Qaida kill INNOCENT people in the West?The West has invaded NON-MUSLIM areas,supported non-Muslim,non-Western dictators, and NON-MUSLIM non-Westerners have NOT killed THOUSANDS of innocent Westerners.
THEOLOGY
You say the West is an aggressor,so does Al-Qaida.The Koran says to attack the agressors,persecutors.You say the West has attacked first,so does Al-Qaida.The Koran says to attack but only if you are attacked first.
The only difference is the idea of who is innocent.Al-Qaida says the ordinary Westerner is NOT innocent,since all know the actions done,and there is indifference,nobody cares.You say no.Then there is sura 9:111,that is why non-Western,non-Muslims do not blow themselves up.
WHAT IS YOU KILL THOSE WHO ARE REALLY INNOCENT?
Al-Qaida,Hamas,Hezbullah have answer for THAT.If you kill the innocent by mistake do not worry,they have gone to heaven.
Part of the problem of responding to this blog, is that it is such a target rich environment. I don’t have to read much to find some Islamic nonsense to expose. A clear case is Yahay Snows allegation of Lust.
ReplyDeleteIn my previous post on this subject I demonstrated Islam’s total depravity when it comes to Gods gift of a woman to a man. I demonstrated how because of Islam he is unable to differentiate and confused lust with finding a woman attractive and wanting to get to know her spiritually and emotionally for marriage. I find it interesting that the same word in Arabic used for marriage is now Arabic slang for the F word, in some if not all Arabic dialects. This clearly demonstrates Islam’s total depravity on marriage.
Now on to what the bible says on marriage.
When I finally do meet the wife that God has set aside for me, I will read these biblical vows to her.
“When I first met you I began to understand the mystery of why a man will leave his father’s house and cling to his wife. This day let it be known that I call you my wife. Before I knew you, you were taken from my rib, not from my foot, nor from my head, but from my side he made you as a helper to me, as God is a helper to man.
My body that I love is no longer mine alone but now belongs to you as well. I will love you as I love my own self and body, feeding you and taking care of you as Christ takes care of his church.
I will love you as Christ love’s the church, I will never disgrace you but always keep you radiant and holy. I will lay down my life for you. I will always be considerate of you, and always will I respect you. I will love you and never be harsh with you. I will only separate myself from you for a short time to devout myself to prayer. I will never deprive you of my affection, nor will I abandon you alone to our bed, for we are united in one flesh.
When we are able to set aside time for ourselves, not out of a demand, or out of fear that angels will curse her, or as payment for food, shelter and clothing, instead she will come to me willing, and we will be a blessing for each other. During those times we will read the Song of Songs to each other as much as possible expressing our love to each other in the only way God approves.
I challenge you Muslims to come up with anything like that from your Quran.
Ali yes Iraq is a Godless place, he is leaving that pace to you Muslims. Your Muslim brethren with seethe with blood lust for one another. They will receive a full measure of his wrath for denying his son, and calling him a liar.
ReplyDeleteminoria ,
ReplyDeleteChristians don't kill innocent men , women & children?
Oh yeah ... you call it 'collateral damage'.
thefatman ,
ReplyDeletedeut25:11-12 '..If two men are fighting and the wife of one of them comes to rescue her husband from his assailant, and she reaches out and seizes him by his private parts, 12 you shall cut off her hand. Show her no pity..'
What has happened to the so call 'love' , 'my body belong to you' etc?
Sad ... isn't it?
minoria I asked for a modern source, like a recent study not something from years ago and not something from another Islamophobic site that supports fascist Rob Spencer and White Supremacist Pam Geller.
ReplyDeleteYou minoria are one of the more intelligent people I've seen. You don't deserve to follow David Wood's ministry, you're too smart for that. A Christian with your awesome character shouldn't belong to that group. You pointed out to me that the Quran call's for self defence, this is ignored by many. You definately are fit for a professional and mature dialogue instead of silly loons like Fatman. From what I've seen on the Answering Muslims blog, your idea's and opinions are very noteworthy and shouldn't be wasted away. It would be excellent if the understanding of that you bring of Islam could be observed by other Christian's.
Now realise minoria, 99% of Al Queda targets are Muslims and Mosques. This Jihad doesn't even make sense! However most of the Jihad in the Quran speaks of the Pagans who constantly persecuted Muslims.
Now onto Fatman. His poem actually cannot be found in the Bible so I find it wierd that he challenges Muslims to bring up somehting from the Quran that matches his biblical-less thoughts I accept your challenge:
ReplyDelete..on the contrary live with them on a footing of kindness and honour. If ye take a dislike to them it may be that ye dislike a thing, and God brings about through it a great deal of good. ( Quran, 4:19)"
"If a wife fears cruelty or desertion on her husband's part, there is no blame on them if they arrange an amicable settlement between themselves; and such settlement is best; even though men's souls are swayed by greed. But if ye do good and practise self-restraint, God is well-acquainted with all that ye do." (Quran, 4:128)
"O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each other. Verily the most honoured of you in the sight of Allah is the most righteous of you. And Allah has full knowledge and is well-acquainted." (Quran, 49:13)
Whoever works righteousness — whether male or female — while he (or she) is a true believer (of Islamic Monotheism) verily, to him We will give a good life (in this world with respect, contentment and lawful provision), and We shall pay them certainly a reward in proportion to the best of what they used to do (i.e. Paradise in the Hereafter)." (Quran 16:97)
"Lo! men who surrender unto Allah, and women who surrender, and men who believe and women who believe, and men who obey and women who obey, and men who speak the truth and women who speak the truth, and men who persevere (in righteousness) and women who persevere, and men who are humble and women who are humble, and men who give alms and women who give alms, and men who fast and women who fast, and men who guard their modesty and women who guard (their modesty), and men who remember Allah much and women who remember - Allah hath prepared for them forgiveness and a vast reward." (Quran 33:35)
Now if Paul was smart he'd include a verse that protects a woman's privacy. But no.
"O prophet, tell your wives, your daughters, and the wives of the believers that they shall lengthen their garments. Thus, they will be recognized (as righteous women) and AVOID BEING INSULTED. GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful". (Quran 33:59)
Fatman you probably didn't know but women do not like unwanted attention. It is an insult when a creepy man stares you down. I hope you don't do this then tell the woman that it was the spirit of God that turned you on. Just get you a big slap.
"Paradise lies at the feet of the mother. "
Narrated Abu Huraira:
A man came to Prophet Muhammad(PBUH) and asked,
"O Allahs Apostle! Who is more entitled to be treated with the best companionship by me?"
The Prophet(PBUH) said, "Your mother." The man said. "Who is next?"
The Prophet(PBUH) said, "Your mother."
The man further said, "Who is next?"
The Prophet(PBUH) said, "Your mother."
The man asked for the fourth time,
"Who is next?" The Prophet(PBUH) said, "Your father."
"The most perfect believer in the matter of faith is one who has excellent behaviour; and the best among you are those who behave best towards their wives."
"Assuredly, women are the twin halves of men."
See Fatman I didn't make up anything like how you did. I brought scripture for evidence. Perhaps it is your turn?
Now onto Fatman. His poem actually cannot be found in the Bible so I find it wierd that he challenges Muslims to bring up somehting from the Quran that matches his biblical-less thoughts I accept your challenge:
ReplyDelete..on the contrary live with them on a footing of kindness and honour. If ye take a dislike to them it may be that ye dislike a thing, and God brings about through it a great deal of good. ( Quran, 4:19)"
"If a wife fears cruelty or desertion on her husband's part, there is no blame on them if they arrange an amicable settlement between themselves; and such settlement is best; even though men's souls are swayed by greed. But if ye do good and practise self-restraint, God is well-acquainted with all that ye do." (Quran, 4:128)
"O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each other. Verily the most honoured of you in the sight of Allah is the most righteous of you. And Allah has full knowledge and is well-acquainted." (Quran, 49:13)
Whoever works righteousness — whether male or female — while he (or she) is a true believer (of Islamic Monotheism) verily, to him We will give a good life (in this world with respect, contentment and lawful provision), and We shall pay them certainly a reward in proportion to the best of what they used to do (i.e. Paradise in the Hereafter)." (Quran 16:97)
"Lo! men who surrender unto Allah, and women who surrender, and men who believe and women who believe, and men who obey and women who obey, and men who speak the truth and women who speak the truth, and men who persevere (in righteousness) and women who persevere, and men who are humble and women who are humble, and men who give alms and women who give alms, and men who fast and women who fast, and men who guard their modesty and women who guard (their modesty), and men who remember Allah much and women who remember - Allah hath prepared for them forgiveness and a vast reward." (Quran 33:35)
Now if Paul was smart he'd include a verse that protects a woman's privacy. But no.
"O prophet, tell your wives, your daughters, and the wives of the believers that they shall lengthen their garments. Thus, they will be recognized (as righteous women) and AVOID BEING INSULTED. GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful". (Quran 33:59)
Fatman you probably didn't know but women do not like unwanted attention. It is an insult when a creepy man stares you down. I hope you don't do this then tell the woman that it was the spirit of God that turned you on. Just get you a big slap.
"Paradise lies at the feet of the mother. "
Narrated Abu Huraira:
A man came to Prophet Muhammad(PBUH) and asked,
"O Allahs Apostle! Who is more entitled to be treated with the best companionship by me?"
The Prophet(PBUH) said, "Your mother." The man said. "Who is next?"
The Prophet(PBUH) said, "Your mother."
The man further said, "Who is next?"
The Prophet(PBUH) said, "Your mother."
The man asked for the fourth time,
"Who is next?" The Prophet(PBUH) said, "Your father."
"The most perfect believer in the matter of faith is one who has excellent behaviour; and the best among you are those who behave best towards their wives."
"Assuredly, women are the twin halves of men."
See Fatman I didn't make up anything like how you did. I brought scripture for evidence. Perhaps it is your turn?
Now onto Fatman. His poem actually cannot be found in the Bible so I find it wierd that he challenges Muslims to bring up somehting from the Quran that matches his biblical-less thoughts I accept your challenge:
ReplyDelete..on the contrary live with them on a footing of kindness and honour. If ye take a dislike to them it may be that ye dislike a thing, and God brings about through it a great deal of good. ( Quran, 4:19)"
"If a wife fears cruelty or desertion on her husband's part, there is no blame on them if they arrange an amicable settlement between themselves; and such settlement is best; even though men's souls are swayed by greed. But if ye do good and practise self-restraint, God is well-acquainted with all that ye do." (Quran, 4:128)
"O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each other. Verily the most honoured of you in the sight of Allah is the most righteous of you. And Allah has full knowledge and is well-acquainted." (Quran, 49:13)
Whoever works righteousness — whether male or female — while he (or she) is a true believer (of Islamic Monotheism) verily, to him We will give a good life (in this world with respect, contentment and lawful provision), and We shall pay them certainly a reward in proportion to the best of what they used to do (i.e. Paradise in the Hereafter)." (Quran 16:97)
"Lo! men who surrender unto Allah, and women who surrender, and men who believe and women who believe, and men who obey and women who obey, and men who speak the truth and women who speak the truth, and men who persevere (in righteousness) and women who persevere, and men who are humble and women who are humble, and men who give alms and women who give alms, and men who fast and women who fast, and men who guard their modesty and women who guard (their modesty), and men who remember Allah much and women who remember - Allah hath prepared for them forgiveness and a vast reward." (Quran 33:35)
Now if Paul was smart he'd include a verse that protects a woman's privacy. But no.
"O prophet, tell your wives, your daughters, and the wives of the believers that they shall lengthen their garments. Thus, they will be recognized (as righteous women) and AVOID BEING INSULTED. GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful". (Quran 33:59)
Fatman you probably didn't know but women do not like unwanted attention. It is an insult when a creepy man stares you down. I hope you don't do this then tell the woman that it was the spirit of God that turned you on. Just get you a big slap.
"Paradise lies at the feet of the mother. "
Narrated Abu Huraira:
A man came to Prophet Muhammad(PBUH) and asked,
"O Allahs Apostle! Who is more entitled to be treated with the best companionship by me?"
The Prophet(PBUH) said, "Your mother." The man said. "Who is next?"
The Prophet(PBUH) said, "Your mother."
The man further said, "Who is next?"
The Prophet(PBUH) said, "Your mother."
The man asked for the fourth time,
"Who is next?" The Prophet(PBUH) said, "Your father."
"The most perfect believer in the matter of faith is one who has excellent behaviour; and the best among you are those who behave best towards their wives."
"Assuredly, women are the twin halves of men."
See Fatman I didn't make up anything like how you did. I brought scripture for evidence. Perhaps it is your turn?
FatMan: I find it interesting that the same word in Arabic used for marriage is now Arabic slang for the F word, in some if not all Arabic dialects. This clearly demonstrates Islam’s total depravity on marriage.
ReplyDeleteThat's just a nonsense your people invented. Christian Taqiyya at its best! You can find a response to the "Nikah is the same as F Word" here
http://spencerwatch.com/2010/11/09/robert-spencer-v-peter-kreeft-the-only-good-muslim-is-a-bad-muslim/
FatMan: When I finally do meet the wife that God has set aside for me
You are forty something and still unmarried? Haha! What a loser!
I would humiliate you more but WomanForTruth has already done that with her excellent response.
@TheFatMan
ReplyDeleteWomanForTruth said:
Fatman you probably didn't know but women do not like unwanted attention. It is an insult when a creepy man stares you down.
I hope you realise the female pastor who you were speaking of would have felt uncomfortable. This is confirmed by a female (WFT). Think about it.
Fatman: Part of the problem of responding to this blog, is that it is such a target rich environment
You are too busy telling us how you will romance your future wife rather than busying yourself in focussing on the "target rich environment". Either that or you are too busy calling internet Christian shows admiring a female pastor whilst calling for a blood thirsty "Christian jihad" against Iranians.
Talk is cheap. You present yourself as a Christian apologist but you do very little apologetics.
Think about it.
WFT:
ReplyDeleteYou minoria are one of the more intelligent people I've seen. You don't deserve to follow David Wood's ministry, you're too smart for that. A Christian with your awesome character shouldn't belong to that group. You pointed out to me that the Quran call's for self defence, this is ignored by many. You definately are fit for a professional and mature dialogue instead of silly loons like Fatman. From what I've seen on the Answering Muslims blog, your idea's and opinions are very noteworthy and shouldn't be wasted away. It would be excellent if the understanding of that you bring of Islam could be observed by other Christian's.
It is true minoria is not amongst the bigot crowd and actually thinks and reads for himself.
I hope minoria comes to Islam one day. I think it is important to differentiate between the Islamophobes and the sincere Christians. Most Christians in the UK are approchable folk but the fundamentalists on the internet are dragging the decent ones through the mud.
Minoria also denonced James White's comments on Brigham Young's wife as sinful. This is something White's crew have never done.hFatMan, childishly agreed with White.
There is such a contrast between a thoughtful Christian and one from the fundamentalist flock.
Hello WomanforTruth:
ReplyDeleteThe reason Al-Qaida(Sunnis) attack (some)Muslims is because those Muslims are SHIAH,they consider them heretics.They destroy SHIAH mosques.
Also they have not killed 100,000 Westerners because they can't do to security,otherwise they would have.Now Hamas(Sunni),Hezbullah(shiah) don't kill Shiahs and Sunnis,but they do kill non-Muslims.
Regarding Fatman,I don't see anything wrong with his expression of admiration for a holy Christian woman.He said he's good-looking so if he weren't Christian he would already have a lover,no need for marriage,like lots do today.
GALLUP POLL:
Ok,it is the most extensive one,50,000 Muslims interviewed FACE to FACE for ONE HOUR from 2001-2007 in 35 Muslim countries.The margin of error=+/- 3%.
The 50,000 sample would represent more than 90% of the 1.2 billion Muslims.
The poll showed there was LITTLE difference between EDUCATED Muslims and non-educated ones in support of terrorist groups.Some 35% said the terorist attacks were justified/or sometimes justified.So ok to kill civilians in rstaurants,shops,buses,airplanes.I said it was 15% because people change their mind over time.
Or the WIKILEAK that came up recently,that a secret poll of 600-800 Muslim UNIVERSITY students in the UK,showed 33% said it was ok to kill for Islam,40% wanted Sharia law.And it was secret information.
TO 1MORE MUSLIM:
Yes,I am sola scriptura.
To Maratsafin:
I know you said the debate was closed.Sorry to hear that.One clarification:MALACHY 3:4 says the sacrifice will be agreable like in the old days.
NO MORE SACRIFICES AFTER 70 AD
Notice,assuming the Talmud is correct,from 30-70 AD the Yom Kippur sacrifice was NOT agreable to God(even in 39 AD),so MALACHY 3:4 refers to the THIRD temple that still has to be built.THEN the sacrifices will be agreable like BEFORE 30 AD.That is the temple referred to in JEREMIAH 33.With that I finish on the subject.
NEW ARGUMENT
To make it short,ISAIAH 9:1-6,ZACHARIAH 9:9-11 talk of the Messiah and HIS RULE(Jesus did not rule).I had showed JEREMIAH talks of a "new covenant/alliance"(BERIT,or brit,in Hebrew).Then ISAIAH 42 says the Messiah will be a "covenant".So ZACHARIAH 9:11(the preceding verses are about the Messiah) has the phrase "the BLOOD of your COVENANT".
That sounds alot like an atonement reference.
The parts about the rule of the Messiah are about the second coming.
Hello WomanforTruth:
ReplyDeleteThe reason Al-Qaida(Sunnis) attack (some)Muslims is because those Muslims are SHIAH,they consider them heretics.They destroy SHIAH mosques.
Also they have not killed 100,000 Westerners because they can't do to security,otherwise they would have.Now Hamas(Sunni),Hezbullah(shiah) don't kill Shiahs and Sunnis,but they do kill non-Muslims.
Regarding Fatman,I don't see anything wrong with his expression of admiration for a holy Christian woman.He said he's good-looking so if he weren't Christian he would already have a lover,no need for marriage,like lots do today.
GALLUP POLL:
Ok,it is the most extensive one,50,000 Muslims interviewed FACE to FACE for ONE HOUR from 2001-2007 in 35 Muslim countries.The margin of error=+/- 3%.
The 50,000 sample would represent more than 90% of the 1.2 billion Muslims.
The poll showed there was LITTLE difference between EDUCATED Muslims and non-educated ones in support of terrorist groups.Some 35% said the terorist attacks were justified/or sometimes justified.So ok to kill civilians in rstaurants,shops,buses,airplanes.I said it was 15% because people change their mind over time.
Or the WIKILEAK that came up recently,that a secret poll of 600-800 Muslim UNIVERSITY students in the UK,showed 33% said it was ok to kill for Islam,40% wanted Sharia law.And it was secret information.
TO 1MORE MUSLIM:
Yes,I am sola scriptura.
To Maratsafin:
I know you said the debate was closed.Sorry to hear that.One clarification:MALACHY 3:4 says the sacrifice will be agreable like in the old days.
NO MORE SACRIFICES AFTER 70 AD
Notice,assuming the Talmud is correct,from 30-70 AD the Yom Kippur sacrifice was NOT agreable to God(even in 39 AD),so MALACHY 3:4 refers to the THIRD temple that still has to be built.THEN the sacrifices will be agreable like BEFORE 30 AD.That is the temple referred to in JEREMIAH 33.With that I finish on the subject.
NEW ARGUMENT
To make it short,ISAIAH 9:1-6,ZACHARIAH 9:9-11 talk of the Messiah and HIS RULE(Jesus did not rule).I had showed JEREMIAH talks of a "new covenant/alliance"(BERIT,or brit,in Hebrew).Then ISAIAH 42 says the Messiah will be a "covenant".So ZACHARIAH 9:11(the preceding verses are about the Messiah) has the phrase "the BLOOD of your COVENANT".
That sounds alot like an atonement reference.
The parts about the rule of the Messiah are about the second coming.
WomanofTruth the foul mouthed Blasphemer has chimed in. She said "His poem actually cannot be found in the Bible so I find it wierd that he challenges Muslims to bring up somehting from the Quran that matches his biblical-less thoughts I accept your challenge:"
ReplyDeleteReally Woman, you should read the bible before you make such absurd claims. Below is a repost with the bible citations.
“When I first met you I began to understand the mystery of why ‘a man will leave his father’s house and cling to his wife’.(Gen 2:24, Eph 5:31-32) This day let it be known that I call you my wife. Before I knew you, you were taken from my rib (Gen 2:22), not from my foot, nor from my head, but from my side he made you “as a helper to me”(Gen2:21), as “God is a helper to man”. (ps 115:11)
My body that I love is no longer mine alone but now belongs to you as well.(1 cor 7:4) I will love you as I love my own self and body, feeding you and taking care of you as Christ takes care of his church. (Eph 5:28-29)
I will love you as Christ love’s the church, I will never disgrace you but always keep you radiant and holy. I will lay down my life for you.(Eph 5:25-27) I will always be considerate of you, and always will I respect you. I will love you and never be harsh with you.(Col 3:19) I will only separate myself from you for a short time to devout myself to prayer.(1 Cor 7:5) I will never deprive you of my affection, nor will I abandon you alone to our bed(1 Cor 7:3-5), for we are united in one flesh. (Gen 2:24)
I count no less then twelve bible citations.
@WomanofTruth
ReplyDeleteI find it telling that in response to what will be my dedication to my wife, what I will declare before God and Men of how I VOW to treat my wife, you give this response from the Quran.
""If a wife fears cruelty or desertion on her husband's part, there is no blame on them if they arrange an amicable settlement between themselves; and such settlement is best; even though men's souls are swayed by greed. But if ye do good and practise self-restraint, God is well-acquainted with all that ye do." (Quran, 4:128)"
Wow here I am vowing and the bible commands me to treat my wife with love, affection, kindness, respect and to NOT BE HARSH WITH HER"
The Quran response, I will divorce you if you act like a Muslim Husband amazing simply amazing.
Yahya Snow caught in another lie
ReplyDeletehe said "calling for a blood thirsty "Christian jihad" against Iranians."
My position is clear, I want all US forces and NATO forces out of the ME. I have said this on that show I said it on this blog I say it on paltalk. I do not want any US soldier or NATO soldier to kill any blood thirsty Jihadi. Why should we when you Muslims are so willing to do that yourselves.
I call for a Sunni Muslim Jihad on Shia Muslims, not a Christian Jihad.
You wrote in this article and even put it in bold "Let’s kill a few more Muslims" and then began to describe my phone call.
Can you tell me where I ever said US or NATO forces should kill more Muslims. On the contrary my view is opposed to that. ALL NATO FORCES SHOULD WITHDRAW FROM THE MIDDLE EAST.
I don't know how much clearer I can be.
And finally Iran is not really the concern of the US, read WIKILEAKS. It is the Sunni countries who fear IRAN, even stating "Iran is the cause of the problems in the region"
May I remind you what theses Shia say and do against your prophets wives and companions. THEY CURSE AISA call her all kinds of dirty names, and they curse some of the companions of your prophet.
But I guess even that doesn't bother you as long as a Christian apologist finds homely woman homely and I find a woman attractive. It doesn't matter how these Shia blaspheme, as long as a US citizen wants his country to leave the region and instead wants those in the region to take care of their own problems. OH THE HORROR OF IT ALL>
@ Ibn
ReplyDeleteTwo things, you either don't speak dialectic Arabic, or you are lying. It is well known that the word for Marriage NIKKAH means the F word in Arabic slang in some dialects.
It was one of the first Arabic curse word I learned from my Iraqi friends.
As a matter of fact the US got in trouble in the early days of the occupation because of this word.
THE CPA put togther a plan to get Iraqi's to help put there country back together. Like all US government entities they came up with a acronym for the plan, NIKKA.
The published fliers did radio and television spots to promote this plan. It went something like this "Help the US help Iraq through NIKKA" or something like that.
Well needless to say that the Iraqi's were offended, there were even riots over this in some places when US troops using there best ARABISH tried to promote it to local Iraqi's.
See what they were saying in Arabic was "Help the US F IRAQ."
Read the book FIASCO by Thomas E Ricks for a better explanation of what happened with the plan.
@Womanof....
ReplyDeleteYou know what creepy men find really creepy. Is woman dressed in all black where you can only see there eyes darting out between a slit in their head gear.
Looks "like witches at black masses".
And seriously I can honestly say that this creepy man finds nothing attractive about you. So you will never have to worry about me looking at you.
FatMan: Two things, you either don't speak dialectic Arabic, or you are lying. It is well known that the word for Marriage NIKKAH means the F word in Arabic slang in some dialects.
ReplyDeleteEven if it means a slang in some dialects, that doesn't necessarily imply that the F word constitutes one of the actual meanings of Nikah (much like how the term "gay" went on from meaning joyful to homosexual). Don't trust me? Look up Lane's lexicon and Hans Wher's dictionary of Arabic.
Fat: Looks "like witches at black masses".
We all know what Christians did to witches!
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ReplyDelete@Ibn thank you for proving my point.
ReplyDeleteHomsexuals took the word gay which means happy and applied it themselves to say that they were happy with being homosexual. That is how they view themselves as happy aka Gay.
In the same way Muslim men took the word that means Marriage in classical Arabic and applied it to themselves to demonstrate how they view marriage. Its just the F word.
@Woman of Truth
ReplyDeleteI give you over 12 Citations from the bible in my wedding VOW and you come up with DIVORCING a abusive Muslim husband. WOW.
But lets take a look at some of your other nonsense.
You quoted something with out a reference "Paradise lies at the feet of your mothers"
I wont get the Islamic source that says "Paradise is in the shade of swords" that is not my intention here.
But lets examine this, you also gave a few hadeeth on how mothers are to be honored and respected. Thats good. But is that really the case in islam.
After you use Sura (4:128) to divorce your cruel Muslim husband. Who get's the kids? The mother who you are to honor, who as you quoted with out a reference has paradise under her feet? Or does the cruel Muslim husband get the children?
Ripping children away from there mothers to put them in the hands of a CRUEL man is not respecting a mother, it is not honoring her. Instead it is the ultimate in cruelty.
FatMan: In the same way Muslim men took the word that means Marriage in classical Arabic and applied it to themselves to demonstrate how they view marriage. Its just the F word.
ReplyDeleteUnfortunately for you, a man who goes by the Quran and hadith sees marriage as something that is more than just sexual intercourse. Marriage is, as the Prophet(saw) said, half the religion. Moreover, as the Quran says, a man and his wife are garments of each other.
It is understandable why you would project your own salacious perception of marriage onto Islam, given that you are 40 and still unmarried which speaks volumes about how sexually desperate YOU are, and also how unattractive women find you. You might as well become a Catholic priest. Lol!
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ReplyDelete@Fatman
ReplyDeleteFatman: Yahya Snow caught in another lie
he said "calling for a blood thirsty "Christian jihad" against Iranians."
This is why I don't like corresponding with you - you just don't try to comprehend what is being said.
The calling for Christian jihad is certainly an accurate portrayl of what you were calling for. You were calling for America to be the insurgents (ie do offensive Jihad) against Iran in IRAQ. Now it does not take a rocket scientist to figure out that will result in many Iraqi deaths.
So is it blood thirsty? Yes!
Is it being presented by a CHRISTIAN? Yes, in fact your Christian pals agreed with it - even though one of whom has family members in Iraq.
You just don't try to comprehend what has been said. I bet you can't even see the severity in your call for insurgency.
As for Shias, I am not a shia but their actions will be judged before Allah.
I certainly do not support the butchering of them - you clearly don't mind butchering them as you want to use their homes as a battle ground.
The sad thing is you are in your forties and seem to be affected by violent videos games in the way adolescents are.
You are still blabbering on about the pastor lady who you find "attractive". I'm not interested - please stop talking about her.
In any case - what is she doing being a pastor? Female pastors? Paul never sanctioned such. You folk are turning churches in America into liberal haunts.
What next? Gay clergy? Hold on, you already have them and they seem to be gaining more and more traction.
So Fatman, how aboput you sort out the mess in your churches before using Iraq as a battle ground to bludgeon a few shias to death.
Stay at home Fatman. It's safer. I don't want to be hearing about you being captured border hopping in the style of the bin laden hunter.
Stay at home and find your future wife - from what I have read you clearly have a lot of things planned for her - you really do sound quite like an eligible bachelor. Those females must be dropping at your feet.
Do send me a postcard from your potentially romantic honeymoon.
I just received a Christmas card and present from a non-muslim pal so I'm in the mood for receiving.
Peace
@Ibn
ReplyDelete"Unfortunately for you, a man who goes by the Quran and hadith sees marriage as something that is more than just sexual intercourse."
You have got to be kidding me. The Quran says your wife is a TILTH to you and you can enter her any way you please.
The Quran says that you are garments for one another. A garment can be worn out, it can get dirty, it is thrown out or given away when it is done being used.
That is a far cry from "Husbands love your wives as you love our own bodies..." and "The wifes body does not belong to her alone but to the husband, and the Husbands body does not belong to him alone but to the wife"
One of the punishments for a un rulely wife is after yelling at her and before beating her is to deprive her of sex.
As Womonof.... Pointed out the woman can divorce her "Cruel" Quran Believing Muslims husbands.
But her is the best part. Its all just sex for you. Wives are to have sex with their husbands any time of the day or night. Weather they feel like it or not. If they don't then not only do the angels curse her all night long, but the Husband does not have to provide support for her. Yeah trading support for sex. Oh the high status of woman in Islam.
So is it any wonder that Muslims would take the word for marriage and turn it into something vile to represent what they believe.
Just like homosexuals took the word for happy and turned it into something vile to represent what they believe.
@Yahay Snow
ReplyDeleteSo let me get this straight. You misrepresent what i say, you put words in my mouth and even put quotes around some of those words to imply that it is a direct quote from me. But I'm the one who doesn't try "to comprehend what is being said.
Amazing I want all US and NATO forces out of the middle east. I do not want the US or NATO to engage Iran. If the Sunni Arab nations feel so threatined by IRAN they can take her on. If they do then then I as a US citizen would have no problem with supporting them with logistics, intel, weapons, training etc... BUT NO US FORCES ARE TO ENGAGE IN FIGHTING.
Now I'm a bad guy for this lol. WOW.
But I do love your admision that JIHAD is violent, blood thirsty and deadly.
I think that should be a good title for a blog post. YAHYA SNOW ADMITS JIHAD IS BLOOD THIRSTY and Deadly.
Or better yet "Yahay Snow says that the Insurgency in Iraq is offensive Jihad and it is blood thirsty and deadly to Iraqi's"
Thanks for playing YAHYA SNOW. I love exposing your hyporcracy.
Oh as far as me being 40 and not married. You assume that I have never been married, you also assume that I have been a Christian all my life. Well I wont disappoint you. keep assuming.
Now moving on the the pastor lady. You brought her up sir, and falsely accused me of lust. I just simply pointed out to you how you exposed your deviant mind by not being able to differentiate between the God given attraction that men have for woman, and your filthy LUST filled mind. I see I did such a good job of it, that you no longer want to discuss this subject.
I bet you think EZ 23 is pornography don't you? Just admit it man. I mean I think it sick that you Muslims view it as porn. But admitting you have a problem is half the battle.
Fatman: You have got to be kidding me. The Quran says your wife is a TILTH to you and you can enter her any way you please.
ReplyDeleteIs sex all you think about? 40 years of being single must be getting to you! Yes, the Quran says the wife is a tilth. Just as for a tilth to flourish, a farmer looks after it with utmost care, seeing that it is watered right, protected from pests, and so forth, so does a husband attend to the needs of her wife, not only materially but also spiritually, to ensure her well being. According to the Al Muntakhab translation
"Your wives are where you cultivate your crop of posterity; they are your field wherein you cultivate mutual affection and emotion directed to attaining pleasure or satisfaction, therefore, till your tilth virtuously as you will and advance piety toward future security and revere Allah..."
FatMan: The Quran says that you are garments for one another. A garment can be worn out, it can get dirty, it is thrown out or given away when it is done being used.
Not literal garments you idiot! The following is taken from ilmfruits.com:
...."Allah (سبحانه وتعالى) compares the relationship between a husband and wife as clothing. Allah (سبحانه وتعالى) says that both the husband and wife are “libaas”, garments, for each other. This shows the equality that Allah places between spouses and how each partner has a role in the relationship. Remember again that Allah (سبحانه وتعالى) puts parables in the Qur’an so that we may ponder, so let’s ponder on how a spouse compares to clothes:
1. Clothes are close to you, behind your clothes is your bare skin. A spouse is close to you in that manner, emotionally and physically.
2. Clothes protect your skin from the outside. A husband is the maintainer of his wife and the wife protects her husband’s home and property.
3. Clothes beautify you. A husband and wife compliment eachother, in this life and the next.
4. Clothes are comfortable. When one is around their spouse, they feel at ease and their hearts are at rest. One can relax around their spouse and find comfort in them and their words when they are in difficulty.
5. Clothes hide and screen you. A husband and wife should not discuss each other’s faults to the outside or complain to others about their spouse."
FatMan: That is a far cry from "Husbands love your wives as you love our own bodies..."
ReplyDeleteIf I love my body by subjecting it to piercings and calorific food, my love for my wife has to be necessarily expressed in a similar manner. Way to go bible!
Fatman: "The wifes body does not belong to her alone but to the husband, and the Husbands body does not belong to him alone but to the wife"
Same logic applies. If a person enjoys torturing his body, then the love for his wife should be expressed in the same way. Moreover, since the wife's body belongs to him, then he has as much rights to use her body as herself. And so, the masochist will gleefully torture her.
FatMan: But her is the best part. Its all just sex for you. Wives are to have sex with their husbands any time of the day or night. Weather they feel like it or not. If they don't then not only do the angels curse her all night long, but the Husband does not have to provide support for her. Yeah trading support for sex. Oh the high status of woman in Islam.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hfYJsQAhl0
Fatman, you paraphrased those verses! I searched them up, not quite how you had it. It wasn't in poetic form.
ReplyDeleteExample, 1 Corinthians 7:4
"The wife's body does not belong to her alone but also to her husband. In the same way, the husband's body does not belong to him alone but also to his wife."
And you wrote: "My body that I love is no longer mine alone but now belongs to you as well"
For Ephesians 5:25-26-27, here is the actual verse:
"Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her"
"to make her holy, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word,"
"He did this to present her to himself as a glorious church without a spot or wrinkle or any other blemish. Instead, she will be holy and without fault"
You wrote: "I will love you as I love my own self and body, feeding you and taking care of you as Christ takes care of his church.
So, you played around with the verses, LOL.
And Aahaha I'm a blasphemer for exposing the holy spirit huh? Foul Mouth? Must be better than calling Sunni terrorists to take out Iran. Does anyone sense a double standard?
Fatman, I had no idea you were that blind. I gave MANY verses and hadiths. 4:128 tells if a woman FEARS FROM HER HUSBAND, there is no blame on her if she wants to divorce.
ReplyDeleteNow to me all those verses in the Bible that tell women to silently obey their husbands outright cancels all other verses. What a total joke such verses commanding women to obey their husbands like a dog without an objection.
"You know what creepy men find really creepy. Is woman dressed in all black where you can only see there eyes darting out between a slit in their head gear.
ReplyDeleteLooks "like witches at black masses".
And seriously I can honestly say that this creepy man finds nothing attractive about you. So you will never have to worry about me looking at you."
Oh good, one less devilish eyes from Christian men.
Black Massses? How racists.
WomanForTruth: Now to me all those verses in the Bible that tell women to silently obey their husbands outright cancels all other verses. What a total joke such verses commanding women to obey their husbands like a dog without an objection.
ReplyDeleteAdditionally, the Gospel does not logically allow for divorce.
"You quoted something with out a reference "Paradise lies at the feet of your mothers"
ReplyDeleteI wont get the Islamic source that says "Paradise is in the shade of swords" that is not my intention here.
But lets examine this, you also gave a few hadeeth on how mothers are to be honored and respected. Thats good. But is that really the case in islam.
After you use Sura (4:128) to divorce your cruel Muslim husband. Who get's the kids? The mother who you are to honor, who as you quoted with out a reference has paradise under her feet? Or does the cruel Muslim husband get the children?
Ripping children away from there mothers to put them in the hands of a CRUEL man is not respecting a mother, it is not honoring her. Instead it is the ultimate in cruelty."
An intelligent person knows that this is a hadith. It seems to me you have a major problem with this. You barely said a thing about this and then quickly moved on. Tell me Fatman what do you think of that hadith?
Child custody? Oh that's easy:
http://islamqa.com/en/ref/8189
"Women have more right to custody of children than men"
Now I'm not a big fan of this site site they're really strict and conservative which goes beyond the limits of Islam (i.e their stance on Apostasy) but there you have it.
Hey Ibn on my blog I've hundreds of articles about Pastor's and Church Officials raping and sexually assaulting young girls and women. NONE of them are Catholic but are Protestants like Fatman. I don't know what the holy spirit is thinking in these monsters, do you fatman?
ReplyDeleteTo Minoria:
ReplyDeleteYou are caught reg handed
If you believe in Sola sriptura, you should stop considering the Talmud as a divine truth. Christians are desperate to the point of going against their belief to prove their point.
Next time I catch you using the Talmud as Divine revelation, I will hand you to the Authority to be burned at the stake, like they did with Servitus. OK ?
Regarding what 1moremuslim said,I never said the Talmud is the word of God,in fact even Orthodox Jews don't consider it all to be the word of God.There is a part they believe to the ORAL LAW transmited for more than 1,000 years from Moses till it was written down.The rest,including what I cited about the Yom Kippur sacrifice,is of HISTORICAL interest.
ReplyDeleteIt is probably true,there is no logical reason to invent the story,though there's always the chance it is false.
Minoria,
ReplyDeleteTNo Minoria, you didn't use the Talmud as Historical record, you connected it with God not accepting the sacrifices. As if the superstitions of the Jews were divinely true. Do you know what the Talmud say about Jesus and Mary, and the Gentiles like you?
Hello 1more muslim:
ReplyDeleteWell I certainly think I used it historically,also I stated twice "if it is true/correct".Yes,I interpreted the statement as God's displeasure,but that is WHAT the Talmud says,the signs were negative,any rabbi understood that negative meant disapproval.Even the Jewish link given by maratsafin says so.
And the Talmud says Jesus was a false prophet,led many astray,that Mary had an affair with a Roman soldier called Panthera and Jesus was the result.
Minoria:
ReplyDeleteIf the Talmud was true, then it should be nothing but a coincidence. Otherwise, If you even entertain that there is 1% probability that the talmud is true about God's disapproval than you believe that it's a divinely inspired document. For a Sola scriptura believer like you, you should appeal to no other scripture beside the chosen books of the Bible, in connection with God. So be consistent in your faith. The Talmud for you, cannot be more relevant than the prophesies of Nostradamus. Can you use the same argument if the Talmud was written by Notradamus? Certainly not. So why do you use Talmud.
If the Talmud is true, than Jesus is the Son of a Roman soldier. And a gentile ( you) is no better than a Dog. Beautiful, isn't it?
@fatman
ReplyDeleteYou wrre never misrepresented. Your words are on audio and have been presented - go and listen to them you will clearly note you admit your plan sounds "blood thirsty and cold" and then you advance the idea of using Iraq to attack Iran as insurgents.
Now you can talk about NATO and US marines all you like but you still want to use Iraq AS A BATTLEFIELD TO HARM IRAN (as insurgents)